SUGGESTION | VCPD uncrime and cop ban for the new script

[Harry O'Connor]

Hello,

I would like to have the cop related commands not only for admins but for VCPD members as well.
I would propos to make uncrime for VCPD Senior Officer+ (to unsuspect a suspect) and copban for Sergeant+.
I already talked to [VU]axxo and he told me it would be good to fo it like this but he needs the permission of the VCPD Chief Legend. So what are the opinions on that? You like it or not? I think it is pretty useful to have it like that.

Regards
Harry O'Connor
VCPD Officer

[Marco]

If it's possible to make, then I see no reason not to support this idea. Not only would it be useful in many situations (had many it would have come in handy) but would actually give players another reason to join VCPD (Tired of being a freecop and asking the admin/topkop to uncrime in a perfectly valid RP scenario? Well, now you can too!; Join VCPD today).

Besides, the only con I see about this would be possible abuse; but then it would actually give the Report section of the forum some use and open the door for abusive cops scenarios (well, I guess there's people into that).

[~Legend~]

The idea has been brought up from time to time and the vast majority have agreed in the past that this would be good on the whole.
The main question was where to draw the line as something being administrative as opposed to being for roleplay.

- Unsuspecting (expunging a crime): Would be very useful, especially if a suspect was cleared through RP after investigation.
This has more than one use and not just limited as a tool for Admins when it comes to removing false /c sus.

Sounds good having it Senior Officer and +


- Cop banning: This one's a bit more tricky as your are potentially locking someone out of a RP role, an aspect of the server altogether.
This is for the time being likely to be best left as an Admin command? What do you think?

If, like in the outgoing server version, you can suspect other police you can just use that for RPing valid corruption. Cop banning should not be used for RP reasons, but more for rulebreaking as it's a special feature just for the police role to prevent people from excessively abusing commands or deathmatching.



Stormeus set up the server /c rank system which was purely to give info on someone's VCPD position, while the earlier system aXXo (and later Stormeus) had put in to set up police commands for certain ranks actually assigned people their permissions. I think these are due a rework and in the newer server we'll see an integrated system where the rank would directly give people access to any permissions that come with it depending on what skin they are using.

Current recognised layout:

Argonath RPG Police Department: ARPD Commissioner
Vice City Police Department: VCPD Cadet, VCPD Officer, VCPD Senior Officer, VCPD Sergeant, VCPD Captain, VCPD Deputy Chief, VCPD Chief
Federal Bureau of Investigation: FBI Agent-Recruit, FBI Agent, FBI Special Agent, FBI Station Commander, FBI Director
Special Weapons And Tactics SWAT Operative, SWAT Associate, SWAT Team Leader, SWAT Commander

[^Shadow^]

I totally agree with /c uncrime, however, /c copban may have it's downsides, as Legend previously stated.

However, FBI Director and VCPD Chief should have the ability to copban ( Legend is already an admin, so I suppose JDC should be able to copban ).

Anyway, /c uncrime for SeniorOfficer+ is okay in my opinion.

[Call_me_Dad]

I'll post a list of ranks and commands here. If the command staff feels the need to make any changes, they will be done.

The ranks currently recognized by the scripts:
The ranks in red are not recognized in the scripts, but mentioned in quoted layout.
The ranks in green are recognized by the script but do not exist in the quoted layout.

Current recognised layout:

Argonath RPG Police Department: ARPD Commissioner
Vice City Police Department: VCPD Cadet, VCPD Officer, VCPD Senior Officer, VCPD Sergeant, VCPD Captain, VCPD Deputy Chief, VCPD Chief
Federal Bureau of Investigation: FBI Agent-Recruit, FBI Agent, FBI Special Agent, FBI Station Commander, FBI Director
Special Weapons And Tactics SWAT Operative, SWAT Associate, SWAT Team Leader, SWAT Commander

Argonath RPG Police Department: ARPD Commissioner
Vice City Police Department: VCPD Cadet, VCPD Officer, VCPD Senior Officer, VCPD Sergeant, VCPD Captain, VCPD Deputy Chief, VCPD Chief
Federal Bureau of Investigation: FBI Agent-Trial, FBI Agent, FBI Special Agent, FBI Station Commander, FBI Deputy Chief, FBI Director
Special Weapons And Tactics SWAT Operative, SWAT Associate, SWAT Team Leader, SWAT Commander

Commands and rights:

/c discharge [Player Name/ID]
Used to discharge an officer from police duty. They can be suspected after being discharged.
Currently, this command can be used by VCPD Sergeant+ and FBI Station Commander+ only on players in their respective departments.
Note that this command can not be used on players that have a higher rank in the department.

/c uncrime [Player Name/ID]
Nothing new in this one.
Currently, this command can be used by VCPD Senior Officer+, FBI Special Agent+ and Moderators+.

/c setpdrank [Player Name/ID] [Department] [Rank]
Sets the rank of a player.
Can only be used by VCPD Captain+ and Managers+

/c copban does not exist for now, but will be added soon. 
I agree with Legend, copban is an administrative issue. For handling a role-play situation the discharge command can be used.

[Harry O'Connor]

I kinda do not agree with the proposition that copban is for admins only.
There are lost of times when there are players on the server getting on police duty to get free weapons to kill people, DMing.
So I still have the opinion that copban should be there for Sgt+ because they are more in touch with all the cops that admins are. I would like to have copban for Sgt+ and Moderator+.
Also, a Sgt can fire a cop out of police job/faction in real so he should be able to use this command for RP purposes and, as I said, he is more in touch with the cops and can punish rulebreaking right away and does not need to call an admin, ecpecially if there are no admins online.

[~Legend~]

The proposed layout looks great aXXo, we can't wait to test it.
I had a few suggestions to try and make the system as 'equal' as possible for all the police departments/branches and to make sure that this rank structure's going to be one that can be sustained over a long time. We've tried to make ranks universal and parallel to other servers and removed the stuff that wasn't needed.



(From above)

The ranks currently recognized by the scripts:
The ranks in red are not recognized in the scripts, but mentioned in quoted layout.
The ranks in green are recognized by the script but do not exist in the quoted layout.

--

Current official ranks (forum etc.)

Argonath RPG Police Department: ARPD Commissioner
Vice City Police Department: VCPD Cadet, VCPD Officer, VCPD Senior Officer, VCPD Sergeant, VCPD Captain, VCPD Deputy Chief, VCPD Chief
Federal Bureau of Investigation: FBI Agent-Recruit, FBI Agent, FBI Special Agent, FBI Station Commander, FBI Director
Special Weapons And Tactics SWAT Operative, SWAT Associate, SWAT Team Leader, SWAT Commander
VCPD Academy: Academy Staff (just added this to show it exists)

--

Current script ranks

Argonath RPG Police Department: ARPD Commissioner
Vice City Police Department: VCPD Cadet, VCPD Officer, VCPD Senior Officer, VCPD Sergeant, VCPD Captain, VCPD Deputy Chief, VCPD Chief
Federal Bureau of Investigation: FBI Agent-Trial, FBI Agent, FBI Special Agent, FBI Station Commander, FBI Deputy Chief, FBI Director
Special Weapons And Tactics SWAT Operative, SWAT Associate, SWAT Team Leader, SWAT Commander


If possible, it would be awesome to have the ranks in the server identical to the ones used for forum membergroups, member lists etc.
That would solve people being left in default ranks and ensure that everyone's recognised - so SWAT doesn't get more ranks scripted than FBI or vice versa, for instance.

But ofc, respecting the scripts we would want to make sure things can remain as simple as possible. So I was wondering if the following (split into A/B) was a possibility.

A Would we be able to add a system where whoever sets the rank can essentially call it what they want to? So, for example, /c setpdrank [Player Name/ID] [Rank]
/c  setpdrank aXXo VCPD Captain. That'd give some flexibility and the guys setting ranks should know exactly what rank they want to assign, using the current member lists for reference.

May prevent having to add the recognised rank of ARPD Commissioner (for example), unless it's needed when someone with that rank comes into the server. In the same way, right now we're not using a FBI Deputy Chief/Deputy Director rank, so though it is unrecognised, if this department in future when Legend's old and gone decides it needs the rank someone can just type it in with the command to 'create' it.

Also, for people that have more than one rank i.e. Academy Staff and FBI Agent, SWAT Operative and VCPD Sergeant, you could set more than one rank on someone's 'police profile' with this system maybe? When you /c rank someone, hopefully then it'd display all the info or at least parts of the info depending on which duty they are?


B If you adopt the above, it wouldn't really help so much with setting the permissions... but could this work?

/c setpdtier [Player Name/ID] [Tier #]

Tier 4: Command Staff
(VCPD Captain, Deputy Chief, Chief | FBI Director | SWAT Commander)

Commands available:
- /c discharge
- /c uncrime
- /c setpdrank
- Command to give out SWAT/FBI(?)

Tier 3
(FBI Station Commander | SWAT Team Leader)

Commands available:
- /c discharge
- /c uncrime
- Command to give out SWAT/FBI(?)

Tier 2
(FBI Special Agent + | VCPD Sergeant +)

Commands available:
- /c discharge
- /c uncrime

Tier 1
(All FBI | VCPD Senior Officer +)

Commands available:
- /c uncrime


Having typed that, gotta admit while A's going to bring flexibility, B is going to become more complex and probably not all that fun from scripting point of view.
I think those tiers are suitable to who (whatever system being used) should have access to those commands and represents seniority proportionately.

Less commands to manage ranks the better, and if A (setting a rank name) and B (setting permissions) can be integrated without having to leave out details, that'd be extremely good. A's flexibility would make sure that whatever rank if/when needed can be used for RP purposes and to recognise people in server. If that flexibility can be retained, while at same time having a simple way of then giving the permissions, that'd be best.

My suggestion in this post is really a reformed way of how things worked in the last server version.
aXXo if scripting is fine and all the above (ranks/permissions) can be added directly like with the system you had in mind, that'd be awesome... and probably would then not need to worry about 2 different commands for naming a rank and giving out permissions. :P

I guess you could follow a similar system to SMF forum membergroups which are named and have permissions + allow more than one rank to be set. If we can reproduce that with server scripts, awesome. :P

[Huntsman]

Well, SA:MP has /cancelsuspect for Snr.Officer + and /bancop for Sergeant +. However, VCMP is much smaller community and im pretty sure that if an officer made it up to his rank, he is mature enough to know when to use the privilleges given. /c uncrime should be allowed to Officers as well, i see no reason to reserve them to Snr.Officer

[Kessu]

If cops are to use /c uncrime, it should be with roleplay only. Uncriming people with investigation is your job, whilst if someone false suspects constantly it is an admin matter.

Copban was discussed before and will not be given to non-admin players.

Senior officer+ is minimum for /c uncrime.

I kinda do not agree with the proposition that copban is for admins only.
There are lost of times when there are players on the server getting on police duty to get free weapons to kill people, DMing.

This is not ARPD's area of problem, but admins. The player is abusing coprole to get free weapons to DM = server rulebreak = admins deal with it. If you see one doing this, report him to either me in MSN or vcmp@argonathrpg.com
I am nearly always on MSN so that shouldn't be a problem.

[Call_me_Dad]

Permissions and ranks are hard coded into the script. Stormeus has already done the hard part and the ranks and permissions in the server are exactly same as the official layout you mentioned(except a few ranks here and there).
There is no problem in modifying the ranks, so the layout will exactly resemble the layout on forum. I'll add the 2 SWAT ranks and the ARPD Commissioner rank soon.

The current '/c setpdrank' command is very user friendly and takes care of both displayed rank and permissions. You dont have to worry about typos and exact rank names, the script takes care of that.
Multiple ranks is not an issue either. Each player has 3 different ranks: VCPD Rank, FBI Rank, SWAT Rank, you can set them all with the same command '/c setpdrank'.
The command also includes the SWAT and FBI privileges, to give out SWAT/FBI you just have to set the player's rank to the lowest rank in SWAT/FBI and they will be able to use SWAT/FBI duty.
To remove a player's rank, you just set their rank in that department to 'none', it will take care of their privileges too.
As I said, it is very user friendly, just play around with it a little bit, you won't even need any documentation. 
As far as future changes in official structure are concerned, good ol' stormeus has created a very well structured ARPD system. Ill just need to edit a few lines in the script and the changes will reflect all over. It will be much easier for the scripters to make small changes in the rank names than the command staff manually giving out ranks all over again.

The /c rank command displays the rank of a player depending on their current duty. If they are a cop, it will display their VCPD Rank. If they are FBI/SWAT, it will show their rank in that department.
The display rank has many other uses. Your rank will be displayed before your name whenever there is a script generated message, example jailing a suspect, getting killed in action etc. 

[~Legend~]

That sounds really great.

If you're good with adding in the current layout of ranks, then that would be very helpful. The new system sounds like a very beneficial step up from what we trialled in the past and if everything can be done through one or two commands that's perfect.

All the official ranks are up to date on member lists + the very last layout I put up here is accurate. I'm hoping this structure will be one that sticks and should not need changes. Of course, just hit me up if you need anything.