Trigger Happy ARPD Officers*?

[Jason Bridges]

This first sprang to my mind when I was patrolling around LS and I drove passed 2 ARPD Officers* aiming their weapons at a suspect who was just standing still, with complete disregard to ARPD regulations, they both opened fire killing the suspect instantly, without warning. My partner and I were not disturbed or bothered by this as it is something we see more or less everyday, new players spawning as cops and then shooting everybody/everything they can see. Despite this, I then proceeded to try and make a living as a taxi driver; for the whole day I did not break any laws or do anything wrong. Supprisingly (or not supprisingly), I was still suspected by 3 different ARPD officers on 3 different occasions, 2 of which were just random reasons like "steal drive" (that is an actual quote) and after each suspection, somehow I was instantly executed, as if it was some kind of firing range. When it had reached the 3rd time that I had been abused and shot dead, I decided to make this topic about it and ask:

-Are there any measures being taken to ensure officers don't abuse police rights?
(not just to punish them after they've caused the damage, but to make sure it does not happen in the first place)

-If so, what measures are being taken to ensure new players who join the server are following ARPD regulation?
(i.e. short tutorials, training lessons, minimum amount of time a player has to spend on the server before they can spawn as a cop etc.)

I think as a member of SAPD I have the right to know what is going on and how this issue is being solved (and it is a huge issue at the moment). I would also like to know what other people think about this, if you also consider it a serious matter or not.

Thank you,

Jason

[KhornateMonkey]

ARPD Officers*

[Jason Bridges]

Corrected now

[Omar Aly]

Hello there, first of all how can we stop somthing like that from happening? We can't be everywhere all at once and usually myself when I see an abusing cop first thing a think of is spraying that cop till he calms down then I speak with him and take action. This is not the idea anyways though we have /cophelp which is recommanded to everyone to read carefully before joining cop force. If you have been abused by an ARPD officer you can make a report Here (As I have noticed you've already done so), and actiong would be taken against him. I think this is more than enough to help you and bare in mind that we all where new players some time. (I myself used to spray ballas to death long ago  )

[Goodandy]

Hello there Jason,

You are correct that this is an ongoing problem. Just today, I noticed about 10 suspections for "fighting" in GS9. Frank Hawk and his people were just standing there doing nothing, and they kept getting abused and suspected and then shoot to death. So, I do agree that something has to be done.

I personally try to tell these Officers to stop doing this, but no matter how you try to approach them about the problem, you either get shoot or ignored completely. As an Academy Manager, I really try telling them to stop, but they just don't listen.

I'd consider some changes to the script as per say a short training session for a week before a new player tries to go on duty... Things like that could prevent these incidents from occurring.

[Plam Knight]

The only way this can be fixed/improved is by our officers actually fixing these mistakes, when they see them, which means when you see that, you stop and you talk with the ARPD Officers and attempt to assist them in learning. No one who is currently part of SAPD, became a good officers out of nowhere, we were all teached by someone eventually.

If they fail to listen, you take evidence and you report them on "Reporting an ARPD Officer".
From there on its local department's work to handle it.

[Badandy]

Thank you for posting this, I am seeing this more commonly also. One way to fix this is have a Big big training sometime or like plam said talk to them.

[Goodandy]

Thank you for posting this, I am seeing this more commonly also. One way to fix this is have a Big big training sometime or like plam said talk to them.

Yes brother, but that nice chat doesn't always work out...

For the training, it all depends on how many Officers would be interested to attend, more then likely, newer Officers would not be interested.

[Francisco Martinez]

Every day 10+ ARPD Officers join. Maybe a quick tutorial when they do /duty for the first time. Impossible to have a Big training.
I always stop by to check when I see many ARPD officers around the suspect... to see if I can help in anything, and most of the times the ARPD officers are actually nice and recognize their mistakes.

[Hank Blayer]

It has always been a problem.
I, myself tried to offer the owners to able it only when they got passport, or even harder license.
I hope that you will agree with me that it is a bit ironic when an officer without any passport or licence pulls over civilians to check if they got one.
The owners said no, and for one reason, "it won't be fair to the other officers, who are already on duty".
So there it ends, and we didn't go any further.

[JDC]

Teach those freecops instead of complaining about them.

[Jason Bridges]

During the time that this report has been put up:

-2 ARPD officers were randomly decided to go on a shotgun massacre and kill everybody in the street, including other police officers and random civillians, after they pulled over an off duty officer.

-3 ARPD officers had pulled me over when I did not break the law, one of them said I need to be searched for drugs, the other said that I was "wrecking" him and the third was just telling me to put my hands up.

-One ARPD officer rammed into me head on when I was parked at Gs9, I then said I wanted to press charges and he just ran off.

Teach those freecops instead of complaining about them.

Easier said than done.

Every day 10+ ARPD Officers join.

What Eric has pointed out is more than correct. 10 officers a day = 70 officers a week, all of which just come, play for a day or two then never visit the server again, but they still leave their path of destruction behind (mass loss of weapons, money and major disruption and threat to civilians). That is more than anybody can handle which is why there should be some sort of control put in place. Also, nobody is complaining here, I made this topic as a discussion to get other peoples opinions and thoughts on the matter and also for my questions to be answered. I feel only to a certain extent is it SAPD officer's responsibility to ensure that other ARPD officers are not abusing; it should be superiors/scripters/admins etc, that make sure server rules (shooting random people in particular) are not broken. I don't think it's very useful for you to say stuff like "teach them" because everybody who sees an abusing cop would already try to solve the situation if possible. Although it's good to see your opinion, what you've said doesn't really benefit this or help at all and I get the impression that you probably haven't been abused by an ARPD officer before, because if you had you'd understand people's anger about the situation.

[Steven J]

hmmm...

In defense to them.. I see everyone from SAPD ignore the majority and you wonder why they do this kind of thing?

I see everyone treat them differently..

Example: SAPD Senior Officer Steven Jeffrey looking for a patrol partner.

ARPD Officer: Sure, where to meet?

Steven: LSPD
_____________________________________________________________________________

2minutes later:

SAPD Officer: ***[cb radio]*** Steven, want to patrol with me?***

Steven: Sure.
_____________________________________________________________________________

Goal: It annoys the ARPD officer you said you would patrol with.

My point of view is that, if you guys stop going back on what you have said.. They might actually be really cool guys who you would enjoy patrolling with. It would make them less likely to abuse the civilians.

They are discriminated alot against, particularly those who never abused no one.

Teach those freecops instead of complaining about them.

This is what they don't like being called.. and to be honest, I absolutely hated being called a "freecop" back when I first applied.

We, as SAPD should be positive role models on the ARPD; to turn them into officers who are more experienced because of us.

The only way this can be fixed/improved is by our officers actually fixing these mistakes, when they see them, which means when you see that, you stop and you talk with the ARPD Officers and attempt to assist them in learning.

Absolutely this..

You guys moan moan moan all day about "Freecops". Start getting more involved with them and those things you "moan" about might actually changed.

[[Rstar]Paul]

I'd like to remind every law enforcement members the following statement:

The inexperienced new police role players must be taken under the SAPD wings, and they must be treated in the same way as every SAPD officer, and you must talk with them with the same respect as you would talk with the Police Chief. In SAPD we believe, no matter what rank or position you have, you must be equally respected as any other Officer, the only thing which separates our jobs is leadership; where we must lead the Officers and entertain them in the role of being police.

It's basically you're responsibility to teach the inexperienced new officers in different ways they suffer from.

[JDC]

What you are doing, JBrdiges, is basically complaining about the problem while indirectly admitting your own inability to do something about it.

If you won't make any proper and sufficient effort to teach these freecops / ARPD Officers about correct conduct, then you have no right to complain.

[Chris Knight]

Not to mention we have sergeants + to deal with those ignorant newcomers refuse get the help,rest can be teached and they will do good if you point them in right direction.

[Omar Aly]

Also FOR EXAMPLE: If there is an ARPD officer which is trying to become better he asks to patrol with me to learn Ignore then he goes to Chris and asks him and Chris ignores then he asks Steven and he ignores then he asks Eric he ignores then he ask Hank and he ignores  then he goes to patrol alone and on the first mistake he does he finds Me, Chris, Steven, Eric and Hank shouting at him and calling him abuser and stuff.. (This is just example I don't mean thoose names are doing that at all) How is that ARPD officer is supoose to learn? He'll just become worst and make his first goal to abuse and anoy thoose people.

[Jason Bridges]

The only way this can be fixed/improved is by our officers actually fixing these mistakes, when they see them

I have to disagree with this because what you are saying is that we have to fix he mistakes new players make? Why can't we prevent them, instead of waiting for somebody to get abused. The problem can ALWAYS be taken out from the source and we dont have to let it eclalate before action is take. That's the reason I made this topic so ideas of a new system can be discussed. Also you mixed two different points in there; getting new players to be come good officers and punishing new players after they abuse. The system you highlighted doesn't really help ARPD learn, as I said before it only cleans up their mess

What you are doing, JBrdiges, is basically complaining about the problem while indirectly admitting your own inability to do something about it.

If you won't make any proper and sufficient effort to teach these freecops / ARPD Officers about correct conduct, then you have no right to complain.

Yes, I have an inability to stop random pepople joining the sever, shooting everybody then quitting and that has happened a lot. But I am not complaining (as I've jut said to you for the second time), I am stating facts about situations that have happened and I am also asking how these other issues are being solved. Whilst doing this I AM actually going out and doing part to teach new officers how basic protocol, we all are.

I have an inability to stop 2 armed ARPD officers going around on a rampage, are you expecting me to be able to stop that? I can't stop random people joining the sever, shooting everybody then quitting either. But I am not complaining (as I've jut said to you for the second time), I am stating facts about situations that have happened and I'm trying to find out if it is possible to prevent that. I can garuntee that every officer who's posted here (including me) has patrolled with new ARPD countless times to try and train them into good officers, we have no reason not to; it's how we expand SAPD. Putting aside your accusations againt me, my question to you is, don't you think the system needs to be changed?

[JDC]

The system of teaching new cops does not need a change... it's the people that do; all of our current cops, especially the excellent ones, are a product of this same system.

If you are not complaining about the new freecops, then you would have not posted this topic at all. No proper teacher goes around saying "I'm f**king tired of these damn students". When you have kids later on as well, you don't expect them to come into this world as good citizens or to be able to filter out the bad ones before they do, teaching and raising them would be YOUR JOB. The same applies for the freecops / ARPD Officers.

There is no perfect automatic prevention mechanism that we can use on every new player to prevent them from turning into a money-hungry and abusive cop, so we must do the next best thing. Yes, that means cleaning up their mess and teaching them not to make any more such mess in the future.

If you think fixing the mistakes of and polishing every freecop / ARPD Officer is a waste of time, then you have no right at all to wear your SAPD badge.

Six words I have for you, JBridges:

Stop complaining and get to work.

[Jason Bridges]

The system of teaching new cops does not need a change... it's the people that do

If that is correct then you'd be able to answer the question of the topic

If you are not complaining about the new freecops, then you would have not posted this topic at all

Not true, I opened this topic to gather opinions and thoughts (read the question on it please)

No proper teacher goes around saying "I'm f**king tired of these damn students". When you have kids later on as well, you don't expect them to come into this world as good citizens or to be able to filter out the bad ones before they do, teaching and raising them would be YOUR JOB. The same applies for the freecops / ARPD Officers.

Comparing new players to babies, not really a good example, because that's a completely different situation. Argonath already DOES filter out bad players (hackers, rulebreakers etc.) and most ARPD Officers don't recieve training before they come onto the field, many of them either ask for help or just go around doing what they THINK is right, which is why I say we need to prevent this from happening, not clean up the mess and punish people after it's already happened.

There is no perfect automatic prevention mechanism that we can use on every new player to prevent them from turning into a money-hungry and abusive cop

Yes, there will never be a full proof system, but there are better facilities we can put in place as other officers have highlighted:

One way to fix this is have a Big big training sometime or like plam said talk to them.

able it only when they got passport, or even harder license.

some changes to the script as per say a short training session for a week before a new player tries to go on duty... Things like that could prevent these incidents from occurring.

Above are what other officers think we should do, and this is your opinion Kolta:

we must do the next best thing. Yes, that means cleaning up their mess and teaching them not to make any more such mess in the future.

That is completely not true and I couldn't disagree more, there are many many ways in which we can prevent new players from abusing and teach them BEFORE they blindly abuse and I say blindly because they are just people who think they're doing the right thing but are oblivious to their wrong doings.

If you think fixing the mistakes of and polishing every freecop / ARPD Officer is a waste of time, then you have no right at all to wear your SAPD badge.

Didn't say that did I, so please don't twist my words. I don't like repeating myself too much but I will say it extra specially slow for you:

we need to stop new players, before they abuse cop duty, not after it's happened

Stop complaining and get to work.

-This is the third time you've accused me of complaining, so please highlight specific areas where you think I have been complaining

Please don't accuse me of not doing my job just because I opened up a discussion that you don't like.

Thank you,

Jason