A little note to ARPD

[Travis Colt]

Hello..

Since my own application has been cancelled and locked, i want to leave a note here, and hope i can help by expressing my opinion towards the complete A.R.P.D. division.

Can any of you.. (meaning all of the staff) explain WHY applications have to take so long?

Maybe he wasn't ready to be in the ARPD, as patience is one of the key features and qualities needed to be an ARPD officer.  In my honest opinion, he seems to be clearly lacking in that area.  Don't get me wrong however, I'm sure he's a good officer, and I've seen him on duty a few times.

Yeah, maybe i wasn't patient enough, altough waiting for a week without any response from anyone is more lack of interest from the staff then 'waiting', isn't it?
ARPD is re-organising, however they should not forget about new people applying, aswell as ex-officers who get fired from ARPD beceause of not checking the forums (not for inactivity..)

My point is that Argonath STILL is a server for fun. Not for strict roleplay full of rules where you set one step wrong and you're out. I even never set a step wrong, aswell as the many officers that were taken from their position as officer last week.
That is also why i have Cancelled my application to ARPD, as it's clearly not really about the fun anymore.
Kidnapping situations can't be handled by a single officer like they used to, look, we're not the TV-show 'Cops'.. I think everyone here does play for fun, but for me that does not include 50 tons of codes and rules, they're a nice add-on to roleplay, but the true roleplay only takes place from yourself, not from the rules written in them.
Forcing to report this and that, not really my style.

Applications apperantly have to take months to get viewed, even tough there was told me as Ex-officer i would be tested if i still was up-to-date right away?
Do Higher members even check the application section weekly? No honestly, do you?
Why always take months about it? Can you answer me that?
Anyone of you? We're still in a roleplay server, i don't really think it has to take that long, i can't believe how many cadets have left the server already without even getting accepted as Cadet. In 2008 i took 4 Months to complete 1 single application, now i have to do the same over again just beceause i haven't looked at a form?

I think that's a little unfair. ARPD isn't looking to the qualities of members anymore, only to it's activity and quantity. That is not a good thing, but after all it just stays my very own opinion.
Please discuss.

[[Rstar]Vince]

I slightly agree.. Just because a cadet or even officer isn't active in one timezone or goes away for a few weeks doesn't mean he/she should be rejected..

[Frederick]

True, but Vince and Ryan, they should report a leave of absence if possible.  Also, I do partially agree, like Vince, on the matter of that applications don't necessarily need to take that long, however, there are a few factors which I'm sure are contributing to the extended time.

One of these is the fact that these officers and people who deal with applications have a life of their own, and need time to perform other tasks.  They may be a driving instructor for example, or possess many other duties.

Another factor would be that you are constantly being monitored before a decision is taken on whether you should be accepted or declined.  As a matter of fact, not only constantly being watched, but also, officers would need to provide some comments on your application.  That can speed up or slow down the application process, depending on whether positive or negative criticism was provided.  So, until someone who is in charge of applications has the chance to monitor your activity and work for a few days, your application will be left alone.  It's a known fact that they cant just accept you because your application was good.  You must at least prove yourself worthy out in the field.

One last factor I'd like to mention is that there's many other applications in queue waiting for results as well.  You're not the only one, and taking the above factors into consideration, will show how it can significantly slow down the application process.

So, try to remember this, and have a little patience when awaiting results on your application.

[[R*]Austin]

I dont understand you.
You say we dont accept people to cadets fast enough, same time you say we accept people on activity. Well in my view, thats the same.
Rushing people to get them accepted without having a proper view of this player is the same as selecting cadets on quantity/activity.

In addition, the reform of the SAPD should make it easier and faster to train and exam cadets. As more people are able to give trainings and recommendations as well as reports.

And as Cortez said, we do not have over 9000 people that can give the final exam. Those who can have also different duties. Adminjob, regular policing and ofcourse their own life.


Argonath is not a strict RP server....... We seek for RP instead, we encourage it. Some people do not know the regular standards and rules of a police men. If we just give everyone a badge things will go out of hand.

ARPD is re-orginizing. Yeah we are, therefor its almost impossible to check people online. Thats what its all about. In addition, we like our officers to keep themselves updated on police regulations and codes by reading the forum, its not a must but we would appreciate it.


Not the TV show cops and 50 tons of codes dont work for you? Then why apply? We also seek for professionalism within the police force. Thats why people like it, and its also easier then typing a whole sentence. Dont look for only the negative sides, also look for the positive.

And all by all, people should be happy we have unlimited vacancies. Thats not like IRL. 

[jemerson]

Like SACS says, Quality above Quantity

[[Rstar]CBFASI]

Do Higher members even check the application section weekly? No honestly, do you?

I used to spend hours each day doing applications...

I then became scripter and LV6 Admin
I also changed RL job from a day job to shifts...

Now which of these should I give up just for you...

Think about it... which ever I give up affects more than 1 person...

SAPD used to have a sytem that was not too slow, but only becuase a couple of persons put significant effort into it, and that stopped happening becuase of other matters including different staff involved. 

The changes taking place right now will slow down things in short term but will hopefully speed things up in long term... Just please be paitiant..

[Jcstodds]

  There is obviously a problem if the applications are completely ignored for 5 days. Ryan is a regular and has a lot of RP experience on the server.
  Although to be fair, to be effective, ARPD officers really do need to check updates on ARPD forums regularly (at least every week). So I agree officer rank removed was in order.

 I do not agree that applications can be ignored. It is not a question of being patient, since even if some people should get more experience, they should at least get a reply... Something along the lines of: "Your application is being considered, in the mean time try and get some recommendations from players". 5 Days is a long time to be ignored. Probability that either moderator inactive for 5 days at same time.... is low.

  I would suggest perhaps one or two more moderators for the applications to cover periods of inactivity for Thomas and Bianconeri since it would be unreasonable to expect 2 guys to be active everyday replying to every application. Then again, I assume they chose this position... so perhaps they are responsible... but I don't know of the job description.

  On the up side... since there are now specific examiner and trainer guidelines put in place, once accepted to cadet the transaction from cadet to officer should be more swift! So whilst SAPD is still in the middle of change, patience is appreciated at the very least!

[jemerson]

If you need help with applications I am more then willing to help. I usually am pretty dedicated with what I do.

[Travis Colt]

I dont understand you.
You say we dont accept people to cadets fast enough, same time you say we accept people on activity. Well in my view, thats the same.
Rushing people to get them accepted without having a proper view of this player is the same as selecting cadets on quantity/activity.

In addition, the reform of the SAPD should make it easier and faster to train and exam cadets. As more people are able to give trainings and recommendations as well as reports.

And as Cortez said, we do not have over 9000 people that can give the final exam. Those who can have also different duties. Adminjob, regular policing and ofcourse their own life.


Argonath is not a strict RP server....... We seek for RP instead, we encourage it. Some people do not know the regular standards and rules of a police men. If we just give everyone a badge things will go out of hand.

ARPD is re-orginizing. Yeah we are, therefor its almost impossible to check people online. Thats what its all about. In addition, we like our officers to keep themselves updated on police regulations and codes by reading the forum, its not a must but we would appreciate it.


Not the TV show cops and 50 tons of codes dont work for you? Then why apply? We also seek for professionalism within the police force. Thats why people like it, and its also easier then typing a whole sentence. Dont look for only the negative sides, also look for the positive.

And all by all, people should be happy we have unlimited vacancies. Thats not like IRL. 

I apply for ARPD beceause it's a police division, police roleplay is something i like, but not in a 'scripted' way as being forced to use codes, procedures etc.
This is not about real officers, this is about roleplay and even that includes every role avaible.
Or how would ARPD respond when a mad wizard joins Argonath and tries to take him out?
Just shoot him?
You have to be opened for all styles of roleplay, not just the most 'realistic' ones.

Do Higher members even check the application section weekly? No honestly, do you?

I used to spend hours each day doing applications...

I then became scripter and LV6 Admin
I also changed RL job from a day job to shifts...

Now which of these should I give up just for you...

Think about it... which ever I give up affects more than 1 person...

SAPD used to have a sytem that was not too slow, but only becuase a couple of persons put significant effort into it, and that stopped happening becuase of other matters including different staff involved. 

The changes taking place right now will slow down things in short term but will hopefully speed things up in long term... Just please be paitiant..

I didn't meant this as a complaint towards you, just as a question.
I know you are busy, but so am i.
Okay, i admit that i don't have the LVL 6 to take care off, but that doesn't mean i have very less free time and have to work in a team where giving yourself only 100% is good enough.
When i get home i want to relax, have some fun.
It really feels bad if you don't have the time of being really full-time active, and just beceause of that getting throwed out of the ARPD.
I was able to daily check the forums at my previous job, since i was just sitting behind the computer all day, but now i got a job that doesn't involve computers at all. You can't expect from me that if i just want to have fun, i go online check forums first for an hour, then have 5 minutes left to join the server for a little fun.

CBF, honestly, how would you feel if you were thrown out of the ARPD beceause you were not checking the forums to often? You are someone who cares about people, aswell as most of the ARPD people in here.
Altough you should not only look at activity. ALOT of officers have lost their rank due to not checking the forums. Or better, not noticing the topic that i had to reply in order to keep my current function.

Re-organisation is good, but take it on to strict.
There are no life-threatening situations here, it's all about fun and that's what i seem to miss here.
If none of you are avaible to check the applications due to personal time shortage or any other reason, then why don't think about of naming people avaible to check applications and monitor them?
I know, it are alot of them, but i'm sure some people would like to offer their help. This idea of Jcs really should be taken in question. It's a great idea.

As i said before, i'm not here to complain or whatever, i just want answers to questions that have raised due to some incidents here.

I never really had been warned (or not that i know), but still i do get fired, thrown out like some kind of unloyal piece of unworth member that has been breaking every single rule he came across.
Where all officers you thrown out that way?
I don't think so.

[Jcstodds]

  The reason it was completely necessary to check activity on forums was so that we could take out ALL of the inactive members. Of course we could have checked ingame activity, which to get a true idea, would involve checking stats DB as well as keeping a tab of their recent ingame trends... which would be impossible or impossibly time dependant.

So whilst a few active Officers were demoted, all of the inactive officers were also demoted, so overall it was a very effective move.

[[R*]Austin]

Too often? I think you barely checked it.
What if recommendations changed in the standards, what if there are meetings? We still like you to check the forum.

We need trust in our people, not only officers. Things have happened in the past, it only shows we cant be to careful.
We like out officer to show interest in the force ARPD. That includes activity on the forum together with activity ingame.

I dont know why your talking about Roleplay actually... We only encourage people in roleplay, if people incest not to learn the codes and not willing to co-operate and be patient, we always have the freecop option where you can roleplay as much as you want in your own way. Do not blame ARPD for other peoples roleplay. In the reformation we like our officers to keep close to the normal standards including codes. They dont have to, but then we will ask ourselfs if we want an officer in the force that is not co-operating.

[Wayne]

Ryan, We will not solve your problem, but you willl, re-apply to SAPD if you feel interessed As you did, but you must wait patiently. You won't win anything here, i belive.
Your just wasting time.. meanwhile your application just can be accepted;
Application takes times to be processed... actually it will be solved.
No need to create such notes...
Officers who got fired can receive back their rank if they re-apply to the force.
But they must show that they are interessed and back to activity.
SAPD doesnt count with numbers, we count with quality.

[Thomas_Crof]

I read something about the applications being ignored for multiple days; I'm sorry about that. SA-MP isn't working, and I have to do exams soon.
IRL goes before the game, for me at least. Please don't blame me too much...

[Bianconeri]

Ryan are you now blaming me for rejecting your application?
you withdrew your application! blame yourself instead of others
you now blame activity checks? that you dont look always?
then go read your application again for the real reason:


also yes i do check applications daily, you just dont know what i do.
but Argonath isnt the only thing in my life, far from, i got better things to do,
also you are not the only one awaiting a chance, i get contacted all the time for some training/exam

in that i do agree with it, every time a high ranked is needed, nobody replies and i do it again,
i race from place to place to handle it, while there are others that could do,
same goes for training/exams, i feel like im the only one doing them,
they all come to me with: they do not have time for me


Argonath indeed isnt a strict server, if we would reject everyone if they would make 1 mistake,
then lots of ppl would be gone already, so dont say we are strict, and that you made a mistake,
and therefore got rejected

ok, we might make a system of noted, so you know we have seen it,
but now dont blame us all for doing nothing, because you have no idea what we do.
for the change you should have our position and know how it is

you cancelled your application, so i rejected you, feel free to re-apply when you are interested

[Travis Colt]

Bianconeri, don't get me wrong.
I didn't even wanted to say you were wrong, beceause you ain't.

The reason why i withdrew my application is more than clear and as Wayne said, i can't do anything to a big organisation as ARPD.

I will comply to your rules then, as i hope ARPD will still be the same for me if i re-join.
I'm sorry if i did look in a hurry, not patient, but really, i'm used that applications get noted.
Waiting for several days without even a reply is not really giving me the idea that you guys are even interested to see an application.

I understand all of you guys have alot to do besides Argonath, and yes, inside Argonath to, you have way more to do..
But please.. Take a little note of what i said, spend just a little time on the applications, you're giving people the wrong idea, or that's how i think it is.

Nevertheless, I've been ARPD since Spring 2008, and the experience i had inside it was good.
I will now re-apply, and be patient. (but please, don't expect me to be silent for more than a month, i have been ARPD before, i think i know the rules as good as all officers inside... )

Regards,

Ryan Caltson.

  I think we're done here.. You can lock if you find it neccesary to.

[Thomas_Crof]

[...]
I understand all of you guys have alot to do besides Argonath, and yes, inside Argonath to, you have way more to do..
But please.. Take a little note of what i said, spend just a little time on the applications, you're giving people the wrong idea, or that's how i think it is.
[..]

We (at least I do) spend more than "just a little time" on the applications. It's not our problem officers do not post in your application. If you did the job for a month, I think you would get why I'm pissed off now. It's a lot of work, more than you think. It's behind the screens, not all on the surface.

Thanks for the attention...

[Bianconeri]

Thomas is right there,
and you are used that your app gets noted? well as far as i know that has never been the case on here

yes we know about you, but as said you are not the only one out there,
Thomas and me ,who mostly handle this promotion, got other things to do also,
i dont know how it is with Thomas, but i get pms for training and all that stuff all the time

i try to do my best for all freecops though(and up also)
but at this moment, with my inactivity as i reported already, i got way more important things then Argonath,
dont get me wrong, but Argonath is really just far down the line of what is important

[[R*]Austin]

ARPD constist of more jobs than only looking for members' applications. ARPD is bigger as it has ever been, conclusion might be that either we got to few staff members that are allowed to accept cadets or simply that it takes abit more patience for you than one year ago.

[Travis Colt]

I wasn't saying you should speed up, it was just stating my opinion.
I fully agree with all of you guys, really.

But would you be happy that you were thrown out for not checking forums, and then have to wait again to re-gain something you actually already mastered?

Anyway, as i said, it's just my opinion, i don't want to offend you guys, and i totally am NOT saying you guys ain't good. Beceause i know ARPD is one of the most best police-based divisions out there. But please understand me to. I don't post this just to get my application done quickly, beceause that's not even respectfull towards you guys.

[~Legend~]

Hey Ryan, in one way I support you on this.
I had this similar problem, I didn't have access to the forums, or a computer in fact, as my PC had crashed.
I had tried to notify as many people as possible, but yet, I was fired for "Not responding to activity check, lack of interest".
I do hope some of these things are more considerate and flexible.

I see what message you are trying to pass on here, the problem is, those with genuine commitment in ARPD are sometimes ignored due to some other members that are generally inactive and we seem to get pushed out in the same flow.
I can't blame people for taking a little extra time, maybe with managing applications. But they must acknowledge that for us as well. We can't always be 100% active due to some reasons, unfortunately.

It's just too bad....